Numetal/Retromux
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@Jennkryst Eehh. Well, fact is, I told the GM what I was trying to do and was told I couldn’t try. It required. GMing. And NPCs and stuff. I guess I could have just run in and tried to shoot him or something, but an intelligent plan that ought to have had a chance of working rather than just being a disruptive kamikaze scene, no.
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@Gashlycrumb said in Numetal/Retromux:
just being a disruptive kamikaze scene, no.
If enough PCs take disruptive kamikaze scenes at the PC leadership, then one would hope staff would take that as a sign that something is amiss in Denmark.
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if you’ve reached a point in a game where you are legitimately considering ham-fistedly trying to force a GM into a scene they have explicitly told you they aren’t going to run, I think it’s time to hang up the cape and put the fang caps away, lol.
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@Wizz This.
I, and others, stuggled to come up with IC reasons to deal with this character, and staff knew it. I, and many others, reported this player’s OOC rudeness to staff repeatedly. (Including a comical moment where the staffer told me how they’d had a talk with the player about their rudeness and the problem was solved, while at the same time the player was paging me rudely, and I told the staffer that was happening and the problem clearly not solved.) Staff knew.
I don’t mind an antangonist/antagonizing PC around. That’s fun. Having to force my character to act against his own interests in order to participate was the problem. Having him launch a suicide attack is, y’know, the same damn thing.
The lesson is more: a) Listen to players when they say another player is a problem, and before they decide to give up and leave or try to blow up the game and leave b) restrain your model-world building at least to the point where you do not need to assign plot-armour to PCs, ‘fudge’ rules to save them from their mistakes, or put up with them being rude, because losing them would lay waste to the setting, and c) Avoid Retro, where supposedly a player who enjoyed such a situation, considered it fair and cool, and bitched about how hard done by he was that nobody liked him, is staffing.
"This is Liberty Hall; you can spit on the mat and call the cat a bastard!"
– A. Bertram Chandler -
@Gashlycrumb said in Numetal/Retromux:
Having to force my character to act against his own interests in order to participate was the problem.
This is a very interesting statement, because for some people, asking their characters to act against their own interests is good RP.
Proud Member of the Pro-Mummy Alliance
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@MisterBoring said in Numetal/Retromux:
@Gashlycrumb said in Numetal/Retromux:
Having to force my character to act against his own interests in order to participate was the problem.
This is a very interesting statement, because for some people, asking their characters to act against their own interests is good RP.
There’s a big difference between characters acting against their own interests to tell a good story, and a player being forced to play a character acting against their own interests to get any participation at all. One is storytelling, the other is denying player agency.
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@Gashlycrumb said in Numetal/Retromux:
b) restrain your model-world building at least to the point where you do not need to assign plot-armour to PCs, ‘fudge’ rules to save them from their mistakes, or put up with them being rude, because losing them would lay waste to the setting
At this point I tend to assume that any game with a PC vampire Prince, werewolf sept alpha, changeling overlord of the whole area covered by the game, etc., is guilty until proven innocent.
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@MisterBoring said in Numetal/Retromux:
@Gashlycrumb said in Numetal/Retromux:
Having to force my character to act against his own interests in order to participate was the problem.
This is a very interesting statement, because for some people, asking their characters to act against their own interests is good RP.
Erm, what?
Larry Leader tells your PC, “Fuck you, you useless fuck. Now lick my asshole for a few hours every week if you want me to give you the chance to do something that will benefit me and almost certainly harm you. I will not pay you for it. I won’t even let it improve your reputation if I can prevent that, and I can.”
So your PC does it 'cause that’s good RP?
"This is Liberty Hall; you can spit on the mat and call the cat a bastard!"
– A. Bertram Chandler -
@MisterBoring said in Numetal/Retromux:
@Gashlycrumb said in Numetal/Retromux:
Having to force my character to act against his own interests in order to participate was the problem.
This is a very interesting statement, because for some people, asking their characters to act against their own interests is good RP.
Just because you’re into spanking doesn’t mean you’ll be cool with somebody pulling out a scourge.
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@Gashlycrumb No, my PC stabs Larry Leader in the face. And when staff goes ‘no this is not allowed’ go ‘I dunno, it sure looks like I got enough successes to kill Larry and take the throne’ and then when I get PK’d other people will maybe quit due to staff cheating fuckery. Or not. But whatevs.
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WOD players are you guys okay??
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Hi @Autumn for clarity, the Prince, Sept Alpha, etc at Retro are NPCs. I also think it’s best for the game and community when NPCs hold these pivotal leadership positions.
I recognize there are several voices here saying ‘I tried, I saw this concerning thing, I felt like I got no traction when voicing my concerns, and I left.’ Which is all very reasonable to me. This hobby is an investment and if it’s not fun, it’s hard to want to continue to invest. I think we’ve all had experiences with this.
I would, however, encourage people with concerns to connect with the HSTs directly, and formally. This helps us differentiate between frustrations that are being vented, and a call for action. It also pulls all three of the HSTs into a discussion, versus just the Sphere lead, about what’s happening, and it helps establish a pattern of behavior (we do track things).
Our current staff line up is:
Chaos (HST, Lead: Vampire)
Daedalus (HST, Mage Lead, Tech)
Ori (HST, Shifter Lead)
Inari (Admin: Build)
Inky (Changeling and Wraith Lead)
Headcrab (Admin: Vampire)
Navi (Admin: Shifter)
Mr. Gutsy (ST: Shifter)
Pumpkinhead (ST: Shifter)
Jaskier (ST: Shifter)There’s been a lot of changes among staff over the past year, there’s also been a lot of changes in the game itself. We’ve grown a lot, and our hope is to continue to grow in a way that promotes a healthy game, with a strong community, that operates with high levels of trust. That has always been where the best stories can be told, and best experiences can be had, and I want us to get there.
But there’s a lot of history, and frankly, a lot of trauma in this community, and we’re all human. It takes time to make things better, and communication, but we’re going to keep trying, and I encourage you guys to keep trying too. Even if it’s not with us.
-Muse/Ori
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@Jennkryst said in Numetal/Retromux:
@Gashlycrumb No, my PC stabs Larry Leader in the face. And when staff goes ‘no this is not allowed’ go ‘I dunno, it sure looks like I got enough successes to kill Larry and take the throne’ and then when I get PK’d other people will maybe quit due to staff cheating fuckery. Or not. But whatevs.
y’all. go outside. for…like…a while.
being in this headspace is just Not Good, for anyone involved.
again:
@Ashkuri said in Numetal/Retromux:
WOD players are you guys okay??
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making mental note to scrap NPC Larry the Prince idea
also…
@Ashkuri said in Numetal/Retromux:
WOD players are you guys okay??
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@Gashlycrumb said in Numetal/Retromux:
Larry Leader tells your PC, “Fuck you, you useless fuck. Now lick my asshole for a few hours every week if you want me to give you the chance to do something that will benefit me and almost certainly harm you. I will not pay you for it. I won’t even let it improve your reputation if I can prevent that, and I can.”
So your PC does it 'cause that’s good RP?
No. Your character’s IC response to being asked is normally where the good RP happens. Though perhaps in some cases the response leads to the same request and repetition is the definition of insanity.
Proud Member of the Pro-Mummy Alliance
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@Wizz said in Numetal/Retromux:
y’all. go outside. for…like…a while.
being in this headspace is just Not Good, for anyone involved.
I work in food service. I mu for pretend fun times, not to put up with the same kind of shit I at least get paid for at work.
Mummy Pun? MUMMY PUN!
She/her -
@Ashkuri said in Numetal/Retromux:
WOD players are you guys okay??
laughs in 30 years of MUSH history
"And the Fool says, pointing to the invertebrate fauna feeding in the graves: 'Here a monarchy reigns, mightier than you: His Majesty the Worm.'"
Italo Calvino, The Castle of Crossed Destines -
Bold to assume that Larry Leader was asking. As if it was a normal RPG story where Lord Larry Leader fills the narrative role of plot-hook-distributor and says, “You peasants, bring me the head of Fred the Foe or I’ll set these puppies on fire!” Yeah, that’s fun, and my IC response is where the fun tends to happen.
But no, that’s not the situation I am describing. Larry’s not asking. There are no negative consequences to Larry if he waits forever to make a move on that head, so he can do it himself when he feels like it, or give it to his bestie, or forget about it. Any loot or interesting information picked up from going to get the head will be his.
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Just picture the prat in your tabletop group who whines “but it’s what my character would do” becomes your supervisor at work. That’s the level of shitfuckery we’re talking about here—I don’t have the exact same experience as Gashly but it’s been going on in WoD (at least) for the past coughcoughcough decades that we all know the dance steps.
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@somasatori said in Numetal/Retromux:
@Ashkuri said in Numetal/Retromux:
WOD players are you guys okay??
laughs in 30 years of MUSH history
I started doing this as a pre-teen, there was never a chance.
